Comments on: Apache Wicket : The greatest Java Web Framework Ever! http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/ Wed, 13 May 2009 14:36:48 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.4 hourly 1 By: me http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/comment-page-1/#comment-428 me Wed, 13 May 2009 14:36:48 +0000 http://anirudhvyas.com/root/?p=3#comment-428 I think that Wicket is nice, but if you part of a software team and you develop a Web application - choosing Wicket over Spring MVC will be very bad choice. The concept of mixing Java and Presentation - there is nothing good in it. No matter what you will do with Wicket and no matter how many code Wicket will generate, you will finally stuck with some presentations problems. But then you will realize, that much logic of the presentation is done in Java, with some hierarchy between classes and so on... so what kind of programmer you need for it? A Java expert who is GUI HTML developer? The Java hierarchy between classes that will finally make an HTML page is also not a good idea, what for you need this in presentation? Choose Velocity, Spring MVC, Tiles 2 and hire an HTML expert. That's it. I think that Wicket is nice, but if you part of a software team and you develop a Web application – choosing Wicket over Spring MVC will be very bad choice. The concept of mixing Java and Presentation – there is nothing good in it.
No matter what you will do with Wicket and no matter how many code Wicket will generate, you will finally stuck with some presentations problems.
But then you will realize, that much logic of the presentation is done in Java, with some hierarchy between classes and so on… so what kind of programmer you need for it?
A Java expert who is GUI HTML developer? The Java hierarchy between classes that will finally make an HTML page is also not a good idea, what for you need this in
presentation? Choose Velocity, Spring MVC, Tiles 2 and hire an HTML expert. That’s it.

]]> By: Antony Stubbs http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/comment-page-1/#comment-197 Antony Stubbs Thu, 19 Feb 2009 16:32:26 +0000 http://anirudhvyas.com/root/?p=3#comment-197 You should do yourself a favour and check out Grails too. You should do yourself a favour and check out Grails too.

]]> By: Peter Thomas http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/comment-page-1/#comment-30 Peter Thomas Fri, 30 May 2008 05:56:49 +0000 http://anirudhvyas.com/root/?p=3#comment-30 Anirudh: Great write up! I agree with your analysis and recently tried to capture the flaws in the MVC Action / JSP approach in a set of slides. It would be great if you can have a look and let me know if there are any points I have missed - based on your experience. You can find the slides here: http://ptrthomas.wordpress.com/2008/05/26/migrating-to-apache-wicket-presentation-slides/ Anirudh: Great write up! I agree with your analysis and recently tried to capture the flaws in the MVC Action / JSP approach in a set of slides. It would be great if you can have a look and let me know if there are any points I have missed – based on your experience.

You can find the slides here:

http://ptrthomas.wordpress.com/2008/05/26/migrating-to-apache-wicket-presentation-slides/

]]> By: Frank Silbermann http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/comment-page-1/#comment-15 Frank Silbermann Tue, 15 Apr 2008 22:28:43 +0000 http://anirudhvyas.com/root/?p=3#comment-15 What I like about Wicket is that you can make self-documenting code that respects the DRY (Don't Repeat Yourself) principle. What I mean by "self-documenting" is that I can modularize a page into panels, give those panels names oriented towards the business logic, and describe my page in those simple, hierarichical terms -- just as I can modularize a batch program as a hierarchy of well-named subroutines. This is much more readable than a HUGE tree of deeply nested tags. If I am using similar panels in many places, I can write a single panel class to cover all the cases, with the differences in each usage configured via the constructor parameters of my panel subclass. Or, I can design my panel subclass with default or abstract methods to be overriden by (possibly anonymous) subclasses. Or I can combine both techniques. This gives me the same abstraction and re-use capabilities for the presentation logic that I already enjoy when coding the business logic. If I want aspects of my application to have declarative configuration, I can simply include a configuration textfile in my application and write my code to read, parse, and use the information contained therein (without relying on the framework creator to guess the aspects I want to be declaratively configured). Once you get the Wicket way of doing things, it's as flexible and powerful as Java itself. What I like about Wicket is that you can make self-documenting code that respects the DRY (Don’t Repeat Yourself) principle.

What I mean by “self-documenting” is that I can modularize a page into panels, give those panels names oriented towards the business logic, and describe my page in those simple, hierarichical terms — just as I can modularize a batch program as a hierarchy of well-named subroutines. This is much more readable than a HUGE tree of deeply nested tags.

If I am using similar panels in many places, I can write a single panel class to cover all the cases, with the differences in each usage configured via the constructor parameters of my panel subclass. Or, I can design my panel subclass with default or abstract methods to be overriden by (possibly anonymous) subclasses. Or I can combine both techniques. This gives me the same abstraction and re-use capabilities for the presentation logic that I already enjoy when coding the business logic.

If I want aspects of my application to have declarative configuration, I can simply include a configuration textfile in my application and write my code to read, parse, and use the information contained therein (without relying on the framework creator to guess the aspects I want to be declaratively configured).

Once you get the Wicket way of doing things, it’s as flexible and powerful as Java itself.

]]> By: Lars Sonchocky-Helldorf http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/comment-page-1/#comment-6 Lars Sonchocky-Helldorf Mon, 14 Apr 2008 22:49:28 +0000 http://anirudhvyas.com/root/?p=3#comment-6 Sadly you completely missed out WebObjects, the mother of all Web Frameworks and still one of the best. WebObjects is not only the Framework that invented component based web development but also comes with one of the best and most mature persistence layers, "Enterprise Objects Framework" or short "EOF". You find a short introduction here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebObjects and more information (including JavaDoc) here: http://developer.apple.com/referencelibrary/DeveloperTools/idxWebObjects-date.html regards, Lars (Wicket and WebObjects user) Sadly you completely missed out WebObjects, the mother of all Web Frameworks and still one of the best. WebObjects is not only the Framework that invented component based web development but also comes with one of the best and most mature persistence layers, “Enterprise Objects Framework” or short “EOF”. You find a short introduction here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WebObjects and more information (including JavaDoc) here: http://developer.apple.com/referencelibrary/DeveloperTools/idxWebObjects-date.html

regards,

Lars (Wicket and WebObjects user)

]]> By: Administrator http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/comment-page-1/#comment-4 Administrator Tue, 01 Apr 2008 03:54:13 +0000 http://anirudhvyas.com/root/?p=3#comment-4 Hey Jon, Btw, we are fans of you, Igor and co. :) I am involved with a project that is using Wicket officially and i was kind of "forced" to look into it ( I was going in ... oh no not again mode, but was surprised) Yeah, i tried Flex recently; it has this incredibly slick feel to it. Slick as in the interface it generates is just unbelievably sweet looking. I am pretty sure that It will be something to watch out for in Next 3 years or so. (My only problem is that I am not familiar with actionScript that much, granted that there are tools that can do that for you). So yes, if there is a patch which bridges Wicket <---> Flex; that will AWESOME!. Btw, I am not so excited about GWT ... Regards Vyas, Anirudh Hey Jon,

Btw, we are fans of you, Igor and co. :)

I am involved with a project that is using Wicket officially and i was kind of “forced” to look into it ( I was going in … oh no not again mode, but was surprised) Yeah, i tried Flex recently; it has this incredibly slick feel to it. Slick as in the interface it generates is just unbelievably sweet looking. I am pretty sure that It will be something to watch out for in Next 3 years or so.

(My only problem is that I am not familiar with actionScript that much, granted that there are tools that can do that for you).

So yes, if there is a patch which bridges Wicket < ---> Flex; that will AWESOME!. Btw, I am not so excited about GWT …

Regards
Vyas, Anirudh

]]> By: Jonathan Locke http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/comment-page-1/#comment-3 Jonathan Locke Sun, 30 Mar 2008 05:38:22 +0000 http://anirudhvyas.com/root/?p=3#comment-3 BTW, I would not write an ordinary web application in anything but Wicket, but I think there is a place for Flex or GWT integration on sites built in Wicket. I look forward to GWT integration in the future. Jon BTW, I would not write an ordinary web application in anything but Wicket, but I think there is a place for Flex or GWT integration on sites built in Wicket. I look forward to GWT integration in the future.

Jon

]]> By: Jonathan Locke http://anirudhvyas.com/root/2008/03/20/apache-wicket-the-greatest-java-web-framework-ever/comment-page-1/#comment-2 Jonathan Locke Sun, 30 Mar 2008 05:35:55 +0000 http://anirudhvyas.com/root/?p=3#comment-2 "Wicket reminds me of Swing Model of programming" Well, i did work on Swing. Perhaps some of that experience rubbed off. ;-) Thanks for the kind words. Always nice to read a blog post like this. Jon “Wicket reminds me of Swing Model of programming”

Well, i did work on Swing. Perhaps some of that experience rubbed off. ;-)

Thanks for the kind words. Always nice to read a blog post like this.

Jon

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